Interview with Dr. Todd Compton—Part 12

AMS: Welcome back to the Apostate Mormon Show with Annie, and this is the last segment we’re going to do today with Dr. Todd Compton. It’s been a fascinating discussion. And, this last question I asked you is important to me. Do you think in some way the LDS Church still teaches polygamy?

TC: Um… Yes, in some ways it does. I think polygamy, for them, has just become this very uncomfortable subject.

AMS: Oh, yea.

TC: Because, it’s so deep in the doctrine and practice that they can’t simply deny it. And on the other hand, there’s so many problematic things about it that they’re very uncomfortable with it, so…

AMS: Yea.

TC: It’s very difficult. But, just to give a couple of examples, there’s D&C 132, that is still in the Doctrine and Covenants. I remember reading in “Mormon Doctrine,” by Bruce R. McConkie, talking about polygamy, and he was very positive about it. And he said, “this holy practice will be restored in the millennium.”

AMS: Um, hum. Oh, yea.

TC: And also, as you mentioned, you have people, men who the first wife dies and then they marry again. They marry for time and eternity, which again is a polygamist marriage from an eternal perspective. So, it’s definitely there. And you know, it’s all over our history, if someone is interested in history, obviously. In our family histories, and so, even if we’re not interested in reading a book of history, with the footnotes, it’s often in the family histories. On the other hand, I think the Church talks about it so little. Even when you deal with D&C 132, they emphasize eternal marriage, they don’t emphasize plural marriage, right?

AMS: Correct.

TC: And, uh… Like people, when the wife dies, the husband re-marrying again. You know, it isn’t a big issue. It has no practical application in this life, and so people don’t make a big deal about it.

AMS: Yea. Yea.

TC: But I think people, basically, often just don’t think about it. When they think about it, often women today say, “no, I don’t want to marry… I don’t want to practice that in the next life.” They kind of have a monogamous point of view when they marry someone. But, you’re right. It’s very much on the books. And it’s very much in Mormon history, and in Mormon doctrine. And, all those statements by 19^th Century leaders that you have to participate in plural marriage to get the fullest salvation are still there.

AMS: Yea.

TC: At some point, the Church is going to need to deal with that, either by completely re-accepting all that, that was said about polygamy, or by saying, “well, they made mistakes and we don’t believe that…”

AMS: Well, I thought they had dealt with the statements about “you must be a polygamist, or in polygamy, or you won’t be exalted,” simply by asking people to turn in their old copies of the Journal of Discourses. But even as recently as a couple months ago, somebody in Utah came out with a book called “More than One - a Sacred Pioneer Heritage,” is what it is. There’s three or four billboards, if you travel on the freeway between Provo and Salt Lake, you will see three or four billboards advertising this book.

TC: Yea, I was just up in Utah and I saw that.

AMS: Yea, and it’s a little shocking…

TC: From what I understand, the guy who’s behind that, he believes in the eternal principle of polygamy, but he does not believe it should be practiced now. (Laughs)

AMS: Yea, well…

TC: So, he’s opposed to present day fundamentalists. I should also mention something we’ve talked about before, that manual, that Brigham Young manual where the Church took out all reference to polygamy. It’s just another example of how ambivalent they are about it. In many ways, they just don’t even want it to be referred to. In one way, that’s a good sign, in that it shows they are distancing themselves from polygamy. In another way, it’s bad, because it’s dishonest, it’s not confronting the problems that were there in the history.

AMS: And you know that the governor, Mike Leavitt, his brother is the guy who prosecuted Tom Greene, and recently I read in an interview that he said that polygamy was bad. That it’s a societal ill. I kind of think, well, how can they say that when their beloved Prophet taught it? And, practiced it to an extreme degree?

TC: Yes, Leavitt is a descendent of Dudley Leavitt, who I talked about earlier, who was a polygamist.

AMS: That’s right! So, it’s everywhere. But, it’s almost like they’re… well, I don’t want to say “mental illness,” but it seems weird to me that it’s so pervasive in this culture, and yet nobody talks about it.

TC: Yea.

AMS: And, if you do talk about it, there’s something wrong with you.

TC: Yup, it’s interesting, isn’t it?

AMS: (Laughs) It’s a very strange thing from an outsider’s perspective. Of course, I call myself an outsider, but I’ve been in Utah for 12 years. So, it’s been a long time, but I still retain a lot of this shock at times, at things I hear people say… I just go, “well, why don’t you want to talk about polygamy? It’s all over your history.”

TC: Yea, if they want to understand Joseph Smith, they can’t understand him without the polygamist part of his life.

AMS: Yup.

TC: You know, and it’s so weird that people don’t understand that he married 33 women, because that was an important part of his life, and he’s such an important figure in Mormon history.

AMS: Yea.

TC: He’s an important figure in American history, let alone Mormon history.

AMS: Sure.

TC: In Mormon history, he’s just overwhelming. And to have this idea that well, there’s this whole portion of his life that is very important, but we’ve got to play like it never happened… It’s silly. And counter-productive, and even dishonest.

AMS: Well, I’m with you. I hope they change their minds about opening up and liberalizing a little bit. I doubt I’ll be rejoining any time soon, but I’ll be rejoicing for the people around me. Because, I think it’s unhealthy to be living with those kinds of mental blockages, where you… You know, the cognitive dissonance – it can drive you insane!

TC: Yea, you’re right. And, I’ve found people who’ve told me that when they discovered about Joseph Smith’s polygamy, they were just severely depressed.

AMS: Yea.

TC: Where, if they’d been exposed to it early, from sympathetic Church members, early in their life, it wouldn’t have come as such a horrible shock.

AMS: Yea.

TC: And so, I agree with you.

AMS: Well, it has been a fabulous conversation. Thank you so much for coming on the show. I really admire your work. I encourage everybody who’s listening to get a copy of your book and read it. It’s a good read. It’s written very… tenderly, almost, about these women. And, it’s really, really well done. (Laughs) I don’t know how to say it better than that. Well done. I really enjoyed the book, and I hope it continues to do well.

TC: Well, thanks for those kind words and thanks for having me.

AMS: You’re most welcome. This is Annie on the Apostate Mormon Show, and I’ve been talking for a very long time to Todd Compton. I’m so grateful you stayed on as long as you did. And, I’ll talk to you soon. Bye, bye.

--Transcription by Archimedes